What are you up to today? 

Working on a 30 years of Burnside article for a Thrasher feature. I’m also working on interviews and collecting photos from photographer’s archives. It’s been really fun to listen to all the stories and see all the photos. Burnside was really gnarly in the early 1990’s. It’s the DNA of DIY, ground zero of where it all started under a bridge.

You mentioned your kids just started at cyber school, how’s that going?

We are one week in. I’m juggling work and helping my kids, so it’s hectic. My wife is helping a lot. We will get it dialed in soon. Major respect to teachers out there, thank you for everything you do.

Were you born and raised in Detroit?

Yeah, I was born in Detroit, on the west side. 

Did you live in the city or the suburbs?

I lived in Detroit for a few years, then Hillsdale which is close to Ohio. Dearborn for a few years, then Sterling Heights for junior high and high school.

What was it like growing up and skating there?

The best, It’s where I first fell in love with skateboarding and learned to skate in the late 1980’s, watching skate videos to learn tricks. Seeing Thrasher for the first time. It was a really special time for me and my friends. One of my favorite things was driving around Detroit as a kid with my dad and he would show me where he went to school, the house he grew up in, where he sold newspapers at the train station in Detroit, going to a Detroit Tiger game was magical for me. 

How about race relations? 1980’s Detroit must have been an interesting place to learn about racism… 

I was a kid in the 1980’s. At nine years old, I don’t personally recall seeing any racism.  As I got older, I learned about the Detroit riots in 1967. My parents were very informative about race relations. They always told me to treat people the same no matter what their ethnicity is. Detroit is a really ethnic place so it was normal to me to be around people of all colors. Detroit has a lot of auto unions and I remember seeing fights with strikers scab labor guys, the guys that would take a job while the strikers were striking, and things would get crazy. I would be scared hiding in the back seat of my dad’s car while we were stopped at a light watching the fights happen. He would explain to me what was going on. 

Did you shoot photos at all when you were a kid? 

I did a little more point and shoot but nothing serious. Just photos of my friends, not action photos. My friend’s sister Cheryl shot photos of us skating in the 80’s. I recently asked my friend if she still had the negs from then. Unfortunately he said his sister had thrown them away but I would love to have those now!

Were you ever sponsored or anything? Did you hope to go pro?

I was never sponsored. I didn’t have any desire to be a pro skater. I loved the act of skateboarding. When I first moved to SF. I would go out with Meza while he was filming in 1991-1992, which was amazing. Aaron would tell me tricks that went down and it blew my mind. I was working and going to school, so when I had a chance to skate I wanted to skate as much as I could, so that’s why I lived downtown SF. I could walk outside my door and skate down 2 hills. One to Civic Center library down Hyde st. or bomb Bush to Black Rock, Union Square or EMB. I liked to ride my skateboard. That’s about it. I didn’t shoot photos at that point but wish I would have been shooting then!

So when and how did you make the trip to SF from Detroit?

I was working construction in Michigan and had finished one year of community college and I was over winter. I felt like the amount I traveled to Chicago, Milwaukee, Ohio it was time to make a major change. I wanted to skate, so California made sense. I chose SF because you didn’t need to own a car to get around, you can skate and take the bus everywhere. That was a big allure to me. I was nineteen and had had a job since I was a kid. Mowing lawns, shoveling snow and paper routes. That taught me the value of a dollar and my parents taught me how to pay bills, write checks, and all that. So for me it was pretty easy, I didn’t need my parents to hold my hand. It was really exciting but I was fortunate things worked out for me and the people I met in SF looked out for me as well. SF was the real deal, it was a skate city.

And how did working for High Speed come about?

I was taking photo classes at City College of SF. I was always around filmers and photogs, Meza, Metty ,Morford, BK… So I started shooting my friends skating. I kept a notebook with all my camera and flash settings numbered 1-36 for each exposure of film. I would ask Morford questions about camera settings and I learned from my mistakes. I loved developing or picking up my slide film from the lab. It was always the best or worst feeling. It was something really cool or totally blowing it. I miss that feeling. Meza introduced me to Lance Dawes and I knew Mark Whiteley from skating. After a few years I was contributing photos to Slap and other skate mags. I went to Europe for 2 months on my own dime with my friend Anthony Claravall who showed me how to travel internationally. He knew a bunch of skaters and we took trains all over Europe, it was incredible! That is, until I got home and got my credit card bill. Lance told me to get the film developed on the Slap account at the photo lab. I had about 50 or 60 rolls of film. I edited the photos and wrote stories to go with them and then dropped off the images and stories on Lance’s desk, but he wasn’t in the office when I went in. I was broke and my friends were going to Visalia skate camp so I jumped in their car. I went for a week to skate with my friends and eat the free camp food, which sucked but I had no money, so I couldn’t complain. When I got home I checked my answering machine. There were no cell phones at that time, only pagers, which I didn’t have. Lance left me a message and was concerned about the photo lab bill and needed me to come into the office to talk to them. I was scared shitless. High Speed was very intimidating to me. Fausto, Phelper, Riggins, they were some of the gnarliest dudes in skateboarding. I went in and Lance and Whiteley were stoked on my photos from Europe. Lance said he was moving to LA and they both asked me if I wanted to be a photo editor and photographer for Slap and It’s been an amazing journey ever since. I was shocked. I was at the right place at the right time.

Did you ever do any other stuff editorially for Slap or Thrasher besides shoot photos? Like write articles or other duties of the mag?

Yeah, random articles like Adroit in Detroit. Ride it Sculpture Park in Detroit. I’m not a great writer, but I try. Burnett and Sieben really help me with their encouragement and I appreciate it. I film Fatback videos. Conjure trips with skaters or jump on company trips. I’m down to help anywhere that I can. 

What are your thoughts on going to college for photography? 

I think college is great! Being a photo assistant to an amazing photographer can be equally as good though. It depends if you have money for college. I did both school and assist because I didn’t have a college fund so it made me hustle a bit more.

Have you ever worked as a professional photographer outside of skating?

Little things here and there. I would like to do more commercial work. 

So you’re in Portland now. What made you make the move and how long have you been up there?

After twenty five plus years in SF it was time to move on. I thought I would die skating down a hill in SF before I moved. I have two awesome kids with my amazing wife and she has family in Portland so it was a smooth transition. I’ve been skating and shooting in Portland for 20 years so I knew it was a great place to live. It will be four years in Portland in December. We love it here. It’s good for my family and skateboarding so that’s a plus.

What’s it been like these past few months with the protests? It looks pretty gnarly on the internet, but I know all that stuff is pretty centralized.

It’s mostly around the courthouse downtown. We have been skating a few blocks from the protest area and the Feds definitely vibe us out and try to intimidate us by driving by multiple times stopping and staring us down. It’s very awkward. Now with all the fires it’s like an apocalypse here. Hopefully everything will mellow out soon. It’s been a really heavy time here.

What do you think white skaters can do to make a difference right now? 

Be good role models on and off your board. Stand up for positive things that they’re interested in and they support. Basically be a good example to your fellow people. Life is short… let’s make it better for everyone. 

Any words of advice or final sentiments you’d like to share with the people? 

Skateboarding is something I have always cherished. It’s treated me well. I’ve met my best friends, traveled, learned about music, art, a lot about myself, and the world because of skateboarding. I’ve said goodbye to some amazing skaters, laughed and cried along this journey over the years. Thanks to the HSP family for this amazing life they have given me to capture skateboarding around the world. Everyone that I have shot with, thanks for the opportunity, and all the floors and couches people have let me rest my head. Keeping pushing 100%.